The most recent information about Odell Beckham Jr's relationship with the Browns comes from Jarvis Landry, and for me, puts OBJ back in the "wants to stick around" category.
Landry and Beckham are essentially brothers, and OBJ won't BS his bro. Landry won't misrepresent his bro.
Baker Mayfield can't be anywhere near as close to OBJ as Landry is, but as his Quarterback, what he says about what OBJ told him carries weight, as well.
These 2 are "Humint" (human intelligence) sources. A real analyst already has these 2 pegged as unusually blunt, honest, and outspoken (read reliable as hell).
Landry's extant relationship with OBJ, Mayfield's professional relationship with him, both players' expertise and a lot of other things matter here.
So does what OBJ himself says...and when did people start...why did he have to say "I never said I wanted out"!?! Why did people turn "who knows what will happen?" into "I want out!" in the first place jeeezzz!!!
"Come get me!"? I don't doubt that OBJ actually said this to at least one opposing Coach, partly because in his place I would have said that stuff (see prior posts).
I agree with what OBJ himself actually said: This is the NFL. Who knows if he will be a Cleveland Brown in 2020? (...how is this controversial?)
MOST of my fellow Browns fans don't pay nearly as much attention to the boring Front Office stuff as I do, or understand analytics (a business term):
Right now Paul DePodesta John Dorsey has some decisions to make:
Joe Schobert, Kareem Hunt, Greg Robinson, and Damarius Randall are the main expiring contract guys in 2019-2020.
DePodesta the Browns have to look a tad deeper than us fans do when making these decisions.
I'll try to simplify the NFL version as it applies to the Browns AMAP, hoping that a few of you might comprehend it:
Joe Schobert has been durable, is in his prime, has excelled in 2 defensive systems, been to a Pro Bowl, still seems to be ascending, and...
Plays a "cheap" (undervalued) position. There will not be a huge bidding war for Joe Schobert, as most GMs think they can find guys like him in the middle and low rounds of the draft.
Joe almost led the league in missed tackles in 2018. The fact that he's much better in 2019 doesn't offset that as much as it should (ok sorry is this getting too deep?)
Check my own earlier posts. I would have traded Schobert for a 3rd round pick or better before this season. I felt that his brains and coverage skills would mean a lot less to Wilks than they did to Wiliams, and that he wouldn't "fix" all those blown tackles.
I was fulla crap. Joe Schobert is one of the best all-around inside linebackers in the NFL again.
...but YOU people (or rather fans in general) don't compare him to Takitaki or Wilson intelligently:
1: Both younger players are massively cheaper, for several years. If one or both project to become 80% as good as Schobert overall, you can't match the highest offers from other teams if they get too rediculous.
2: Schobert is a LEADER and a core player. He is NOW (at least) a top 5 inside linebacker, vs the run as well as in coverage.
DePodesta Dorsey needs to pay him (you know...instead of letting him go for NOTHING?)
...I was about to get into Hunt and OBJ, but think I might have established a common sense beach-head here in re common sense analytics:
Schobert plays a undervalued position, but is in (at least) the top 5 there. He excels in every way, and...
Mack Wilson has RECENTLY showed great promise (he has improved in all phases recently DO YOU UNDERSTAND?), and Takitaki has showed up a little, but for DePodesta, retaining Schobert is affordable and smart.
Damarius Randall is a tougher call, as (under Steve Wilks) he's not so critical, and he has Redwine in his face. He's also been injured and had some mysterious off-field issues but I digress:
At least 4 Brinks Trucks will back up to the Browns' loading dock in 2020, and at least 1 or 2 will be turned away.
I will expound later, but for now expect the Schobert and Hunt trucks to get loaded.
More immediately, the Browns beat the Cards. Forget the "drama". The Browns are the better team.
Updated w/l prediction: 9-7
Odell Beckham Jr and Kareem Hunt are unlikely to be with the Browns in 2020 per Chris Rose.
I haven't actually listened to Chris on that link, but am just guessing that he isn't an idiot and sorta guessing at what he said:
The OBJ part is probably true, though not for the emotional, irrational reasons that many will cite. The gossip-mongers are hanging on Beckham's every word, desperately seeking drama and controversey.
OBJ is worth tons in a trade, especially since the fact that he's been playing hurt all season is now a big issue (what with Mayfield's comments and all)...
...
...but Kareem Hunt is different.
Remember the whole Enineezer Bell controversey? Bell wanted elite WR money because, well, he caught more passes for more yards than a lot of wide receivers.
My inner-agent always took this argument seriously--but as I predicted/we have seen, the Steelers' exceptional Offensive Line, Quarterback, Antonio Brown etc were the wind beneath Ebineezer's wings, and had the Steelers met his demands, they would have had to CUT a bunch of those guys (but I digress):
Kareem Hunt is like Bell (except better).
He is listed as a starter at Running Back, but he's really a starter at every offensive skill position except Tight End.
Kareem Hunt is a WEAPON, period.
His off-field idiocy, as well as the "dime a dozen" RB position he plays mitigate against Kareem's leverage.
Here, Hunt is being used all over the place.
Nick Chubb is the "bellcow", but he's also taking the beating a bellcow takes, and Hunt knows all about that. I imagine a long, healthy carreer with a Superbowl or 2 are worth considering, no?
I also believe Hunt when he says he loves Nick Chubb. He proves it with his great lead-blocks.
Ignore the labels: Paul Depodesta John Dorsey will try hard to retain this swiss army knife weapon long-term, and have a decent shot of getting it done.
I HAVE SPOKEN.
This garbage is just rediculous. Freddie Kitchens and his players might as well be the Hunchback of Notre Dame, the Frankenstein monster, or Donald Trump.
In the age of social media, the same vicious mob instincts manifest on a grander scale and are amplified.
A lot of people look for puppies to kick, and jump on the most recent lynch-mob target. Now you've got people in New Zealand regurgitating "dysfunction" and "dumpster fire", and it's muffling everything else.
It's all one big fake reality show for you people! More drama, please! Gossip! Rumors! Buncha teenage (mean) girls who could care less about football STOPITSTOPITSTOPIT #!!×(￦"'%_#!&"!!!
Anyway, here on this planet:
Rookie Safety Sheldrick Redwine (like Mack Wilson) has become integral to Steve Wilks' defense. Sione Takitaki is also showing up more and more often in the regular defense.
Second year DE Chad Thomas has emerged as a...well a decent player, who in the absence of Garrett and Vernon is starting.
Rookie corner Greedy Williams is a little shaky, but he's starting already too (over 2 quality veterans).
All these guys are comparatively cheap...does anybody else get this?
OBJ is a huge asset, with great trade value. Why is everybody fixated on his emotional state, and either bashing him or using him to bash the organization?
Can you imagine these gossip-mongers trying to run an NFL fanchise (or any other business)?
No: You just trade him, like I said Dorsey might the day after he traded FOR him because business is business.
Trade OBJ (and his salary), release Kirksey and maybe Randall and save their salaries, and you can restore your cap surplus and pile up more draft picks.
Now you might think that John Dorsey can't do this, but that's because you have forgotten Paul DePodesta.
I believe that Dorsey and DePodesta get along just fine, as I keep hearing Dorsey talking analyticsese as he describes prospects and his own players.
For those who are new here, Paul DePodesta is not here to scout talent, but as an efficiency expert.
In general, he will try to make sure that older players in decline are released in favor of younger (ascending) cheaper players, that guys like OBJ are traded for great value, that (maybe) a Kareem Hunt is re-signed for big money (with an eye to possibly trading him in a year or 3)...
Lamm evidently was ok at Right Tackle in Hubbard's absence, and Teller hasn't sucked too bad at Right Guard.
In a nutshell, the Browns' overall future looks great...if you can get past the "dysfunctional" Jerry Springer "Dumpster Fire" narrative; if you can (sigh) think with your brain?
Right now, in my opinion, Jimmy Haslam needs to KEEP Kitchens, Hunt, and Schobert.
OBJ should be traded! Mayfield never needed him in the first place, and Dorsey didn't need his salary.
If you think Baker Mayfield is a bust, you are an idiot. Aaron Rodgers might well have looked similar if he'd started as a rookie, but Mayfield is damn near a clone of Rodgers, ok?
PS not Russell Wilson or Brett Favre or Brees or anybody else, ok? Mayfield is a one inch shorter future Aaron Rodgers, and I guess the Browns will just have to deal with that somehow...
Anyway if I can get you people out of the Springer show for a minute, things are looking up long-term, and -snap-snap- short term TOO!!!
The loss to the Steelers was...inexusable, but the Browns dominated the Ravens, beat the Steelers and Bills, came close vs the Pats, and...well the sky isn't falling ok?
No playoffs on 2019, probably, but 2020 was the target year in the first place (before Dorsey was hired and tried to get there sooner)...
DePodesta--did I mention him?
Nevermind okbye
Even I can't say much about the Browns being all but dominated by the Bengals, yet winning at home.
Baker Mayfield in particular was, flashes aside, putrid again...it's just depressing--what the hell is wrong here?
No offense to the Bengals, who don't really suck as bad as everybody thinks with Dalton at the helm.
The Bengals offense had a great game plan, and a Division rival's success vs the Browns' defense isn't all that upsetting, considering that the defense delivered when it mattered.
But Mayfield...no, not the offense in general, but just Mayfield...
Full disclosure I only listened to the game, but trust Doug and Jim:
The Bengals' defense did a great job stuffing Nick Chubb early on. Hunt had slightly better luck on his few carries, but when you gain or lose a yard, even on first down, you need to pass, see?
The defense knows it, so it's tougher to sell play action.
The Bengals D then exploited Tretter's injury and Hubbard's absence.
No don't bash Freddie's playcalling. He tried to lean on play-action. He used rollouts. He pitched out and threw to Landry and Hunt. Max protect with extra tight ends and running backs. Misdirection--quit using Freddie as your whipping boy.
Any quarterback would have had a hard time under that much pressure, but Baker should be playing better.
Remember, at Oklahoma Mayfield was renowned for his touch and accuracy, whether throwing with his feet planted or in motion. The more pressure he felt, the better he got.
That's not what we're seeing in 2019.
Ah well. So OBJ may have told some people around the league that he wants out of Cleveland. Big deal. He's allowed to express himself, and if you want to bash him for it you are unreasonable.
He's been playing hurt all season long; he'll need an operation at the end of the season. He's been more than a good soldier. Get off his freaking back.
And I'd want out, too. He's having his worst season ever. The offensive line is going to be hard to fix. The run bias looks here to stay. Njoku, Landry, and even Hunt (if he stays) are taking his targets.
Kitchens is under fire and OBJ no doubt fears a regime-change...while stuck in the same division as the Ravens, and he can't even be optimistic about a Superbowl in 2020.
Anyway, the draft pick(s) and/or offensive linemen players which OBJ could fetch in a trade are more valuable to this specific team than OBJ is, and DePodesta Dorsey might already be working on that.
Baker Mayfield shouldn't have picked on the Browns' training staff in public in re how OBJ's injury was (mis)handled, but what he said, if it's true, is upsetting:
If the operation could have gotten a healthy Beckham on the field by game 4, well?
On the other hand, OBJ and his agent were part of this decision.
Baker later admitted that he didn't know the whole story, but was standing up for a teammate who is getting bashed for...well for no reason.
I skimmed an article by a New York writer who said that OBJ and Mayfield poured gasoline on the Browns' "dumpster fire".
I'm so sick of this ignorance. 1-31 was a dumpster fire. A game under .500 isn't...you idiot.
I fully expect to hear "dysfuntional" hundreds of times this week, more Kitchens-bashing, and...mindless parrotting of mindless analysts saying what other mindless analysts said rinse and repeat just shoot me (please) I can't stand this insanity
A lot of people, including Mary Kay Cabbott, are blaming the wrong people for the Browns' dissapointing season.
1: When Freddie Kitchens and Todd Monken don't "connect", it's good for the Browns. Multiple Tight Ends and the 2-back have Freddie's fingerprints all over them.
Abandoning the run prematurely is more likely on Monken. Look no further back than Freddie's 2018 stint as Offensive Coordinator, and compare that to Monken's Buccaneer offense. I mean DUH.
2: Until the second half vs the Steelers, Freddie's playcalling was pretty good, and even here, down and distance can force more passes.
3: Dan Justik exposes the real "culprits" here, and these are the Offensive Line, and John Dorsey.
Aside from Tretter and Bitonio, the Browns Offensive Line is below average (especially at Tackle). Baker Mayfield gets too much pressure too soon, and they've had to go more "West Coast", despite an impressive running game (read play-action) and Mayfield's mobility and ability to improvise.
In fairness to Dorsey (see earlier posts), all of his veteran free agent Offensive Linemen were above average in pass protection per PFF, so his strategy made sense for a zone-blocking offense.
But, as Dan points out, Dorsey overpaid Hubbard, and drafted Austin Corbett atop the second round. Not good.
4: Blaming the Coaches for OBJ's substandard season is simpletonian.
OBJ avoided most of the offseason workouts. Mayfield doesn't "miss" Landry: there it is.
4a: Trying to FORCE the ball to OBJ deep has probably done more harm than good.
Certainly you can bash Kitchens for this, but please make up your mind: Is Freddie incompetent for sending OBJ deep and making Mayfield focus on him, or for doing more West Coast stuff and letting Mayfield spread it around?
New topic: OBJ-bashing is assenine. HE hasn't said anything about wanting "out", let alone made any demands whatsoever.
Pat Kirwan and the rest of you need to quit reminding Beckham that he's under contract and powerless...
Again full disclosure: English is my first language, and I always hear or read what is said or written, verbatum.
I can't figure out why these clowns are picking on OBJ. JFC he can't even answer questions anymore! He could say "yes", "no", "maybe", or "no comment" and get crucified!
Pat Kirwan et al: What tf did OBJ say that you managed to mangle into a "demand" or...whatever? Why TF are you lecturing Beckham on contract law!?!
And yes, I have to invoke Donald Trump and impeachment here, because the similarities are obvious.
Just to clarify for any new readers: OBJ has always been a team player. He has made a fool of himself sometimes, and loves attention, but despite the weekly questions about his unexpectedly low production, he's been a model politician as a Brown.
In a nutshell, OBJ blabbering too much but essentially saying "I don't know" about his future with the Browns shouldn't have got Charlie Weiss, Pat Kirwan et al all up in his face lecturing him about contract law!!!
Good GRIEF OBJ said NOTHING wrong, or even controversial! And here we go with this "Impeach OBJ" bullshit!
Wow. Just...wow.
Thanks to Chris Trapasso, I have noticed new practice squad addition Justin Zimmer, who is a disruptive passrushing Defensive Lineman from...Ferris State?
Yep! Division II. Justin wasn't invited to the 2016 Combine, but blew up a regional combine with amazing numbers, including a 33.5" vertical leap and 7.01 3-cone at 302 lbs., both of which, along with his broad jump and bench press (44 reps) bested Aaron Donald.
Donald clocked a shocking 4.68 40, whereas Zimmer's was 4.86, but if we can come down from the nose bleed section, 4.86 is a decent time for a Defensive End and a great time for a DT.
The leaps and bench press are about explosiveness, or "suddenness", and the 3-cone is about agility and balance. If you took the names off these 2 players and didn't know where they played in college, a lot of scouts would favor Zimmer over Donald (who is shorter and smaller).
That 7.01 3-cone is a good time for a linebacker; okay for a safety--some cornerbacks never get under 7 seconds!
Without a doubt, Zimmer took a huge step up in class when he entered the NFL, and had a lot to learn, but he's now in his third NFL season. That's when these "project" players tend to blossom.
With Myles Garrett suspended, Olivier Vernon dealing with lingering issues, and a possible depth issue behind Ogunjobi and Richardson inside, Justin Zimmer (listed as a backup DT) should get some reps vs the Bengals.
On the Ourlads current Browns Depth Chart, Larry Ogunjobi is actually listed as the starting Left DE (ahead of Chad Thomas), and as we know, Richardson has been playing some Defensive End too.
It seems like Steve Wilks and company are sort of bulking up up front, and using selective blitzes to compensate for Myles Garrett's absence.
I know that the Steelers beat the Browns last week, but if you look at the numbers, it seems to be working okay.
Zimmer could help a lot, IF he's ready to live up to his potential. If Richardson and Ogunjobi can play DE, Zimmer certainly can, and if Aaron Donald can play DT well...there ya go!
Brandin Bryant is listed as the starting DT ahead of Zimmer, and I can't find anything on him. They must see something in him, though.
David Njoku should be active vs the Bengals, and he could make a big difference.
As I've informed my crickets, asshole scumbag analysis-stealers etc, David Njoku looms as a huge secret weapon.
The majority of the people who steal and regurgitate unattributed stuff from this Blog are (so far) oblivious to Njoku's existance (not to mention his impact on the offense)
I expect my extremely few followers (with the exception of my twin brother) to acknowlege my correctitude, since it is obvious and irrefutable.
Anyway Freddie Kitchens is not an idiot, should not be fired (yet), Baker Mayfield is not a bust, and the Browns' fan-base ought to stop spazzing out.
You want to FIRE people...AGAIN!?! How can you reconcile that with your Haslam-bashing?
Can any of you...THINK?
Just...shoot me
It's not too soon for John Dorsey to consider which current Browns short-timers he needs to prioritize, and Justice Sunderland (who might well read this Blog) wonders, as I have been wondering in this space, what about Kareem (Hunt)?
It looks like Justice is one of many who read this blog and regurgitate it sans attribution, but I can't assume that yet. He might actually be a genius in his own right.
Anyway, everything he says is smart and insightful:
Justice thinks that the bidding war for Kareem Hunt might make him just too expensive to keep, but his off the field issues, his injury, and the position he plays (running back, ok?) will mitigate against this.
Hunt also grew up here, has bonded with Nick Chubb and accepted his diminished role, and might accept less money to stay in Cleveland:
1: As a "bellcow" guy, Hunt knows his carreer will be shorter (and more painful).
2: He's Chubb's default backup, and is likely to get more chances, because (see "1").
3: Freddie Kitchens (not Todd Monken) has a unique (starting) role for him in a unique NFL offense which isn't far behind the Ravens conceptually.
4: The Browns are young, and one of the most talented teams in the NFL. Kareem Hunt seems to want to win slightly more than he wants to squeeze crap out of the last Buffalo nickel.
5: (see posts from shortly after Hunt's signing): Nick Chubb has 2 years remaining on his rookie contract. Overpaying Kareem Hunt in 2020 makes him instantly extremely tradeable.
Keeping up with me here?
For at least 2020, paying Kareem Hunt would preserve a souped-up Mack/Byner offense, retain one of the best running/receiving (not to mention blocking) big-play weapons in the NFL.
Ah yeah it gets deep here (sorry). OBJ might turn into GMF in 2020. That trade would free up significant cap space, and re-signing Hunt (as a running back) would be comparatively cheap in the real world.
Obviously, 2019 probably isn't a Superbowl year for the Browns, but 2020 could be.
Retaining Kitchens, Hunt, Schobert, (maybe) Robinson etc could make that difference.
Yeah Kitchens! Freddie knows how to exploit a Chubb/Hunt 2-back offense. I haven't seen that anywhere else in the modern NFL.
John Dorsey needs to pay Kareem Hunt and keep Freddie Kitchens. If he fires Freddie, odds are he has to let Hunt go, because in 2020, Freddie Kitchens might just be THE ONLY NFL Coach who is "dumb" enough to run a 2-back offense...
It amazes me that using 2 running backs (not a scatback and converted linebacker blocking fullback ie a REAL 2-back) is so "unthinkable" in 2019, but do you get this?
If Dorsey fires Freddie, Kareem Hunt is almost certainly a GMF too...unless the new genius converts him to a wide receiver or something (gimme a break).
Freddie Kitchens might not be an offensive genius, but he has common sense, and makes the most of what he has.
That's what Bill Belichick did and does...
IS ANY OF THIS SINKING IN YET?
WTF why do I bother?
This just in: I respect Geoff Schwartze as a tier 2 X's and O's guy and a borderline tier 1 locker room guy, but his blabberage about Freddie's "Pittsburgh Started It" T-shirt (T-Shirtgate) is just plain stupid.
Freddie needs to "grow up", per Schwartze.
No, Mitchell Geoff---it was pretty cool since it was the truth, and the NFL can't fine Freddie for it.
And all the players on the team LOVE Kitchens for it. Schwartze is below average on any subject other than offensive lines and applicable schemes.
Freddie Kitchens needs to get better in some ways, but his choice of T-shirts isn't one of them.
Geoff? This is why you're not a Coach.
